A Cut Above the Rest: One-on-One with Tim Gunn
When the news broke in 2018 that Project Runway’s dynamic duo, host/judge Heidi Klum and contestants’ mentor Tim Gunn, were leaving the show, fans were heartbroken. However, it would not be the end for this iconic pair. Klum and Gunn departed from Project Runway to partner and create their own fashion competition series called Making the Cut, which premiered on Amazon Prime Video March 27.
In Making the Cut, 12 designers and entrepreneurs are given the opportunity to compete against one another in an international competition and elevate one of their businesses with $1 million, a mentorship from Amazon Fashion head Christine Beauchamp, and an exclusive clothing line on Amazon. Two episodes will air weekly for five weeks, with the finale scheduled to air on April 24. Additionally, the winning looks will be available to purchase on Amazon immediately after each episode.
OUT FRONT had the pleasure of chatting more with Gunn about the show, why he and Klum decided to pursue this new venture, and how he never really intended to pursue a career in fashion. In the end, he made it work.
Hi, Tim! Thank you for taking the time to chat with me about your brand-new Amazon show, Making the Cut. What can viewers expect?
The comparisons to Project Runway are going to be natural, of course. As Heidi and I say, we wouldn’t have Making the Cut if we haven’t had the Project Runway experience. It’s an evolution of that brand in many, many ways, and our executive producer, Sara Rea’, was the showrunner for Runway for our last 11 seasons. So, no one knows better than Sara about what we can and can’t do and shouldn’t do. Heidi, Sara, and I have been huddling for years about what we wanted to do with Runway, and you know how network executives are. They are very intractable when something’s a success. They don’t want to change it, and Heidi, Sara, and I had a vision about what we wanted to do.
We wanted to do something more global, and we wanted to really talk about branding because you can have a beautiful dress, but if you don’t understand sourcing, production, marketing, visual merchandising, retail, if you don’t have that entire rubric of a skill set, then you’re lost. So, Making the Cut is really about branding. It’s the conversation that we’re always coming back to when I’m making my rounds at the design studio. I’m always asking the designers, how does this particular garment fit in with the larger vision of your brand? It’s a more comprehensive dialogue, and frankly, a much more interesting one.
I can’t wait to watch it. So, branding is the major difference between Making the Cut and Project Runway?
Absolutely. Also, Making the Cut is not a sewing show. Are the designers making clothes? Yes, but we are also providing them with seamstresses. They leave the design studio at night, and the seamstresses take over.
Gotcha. It sounds like pursuing this new adventure was not a difficult decision for you and Heidi.
We were ecstatic! The fact that Runway was going back to Bravo after so many seasons on Lifetime for us was the opportunity. Okay, things are now different. Let’s do this. We were tremendously excited about it, and I’ll tell you, we were in very serious conversations with Netflix because Heidi has a lot of contacts there.
The conversations were great, but then Amazon reached out to us saying, ‘We hear you’re talking to Netflix; we want to talk to you.’ That’s what all happened, and the Amazon conversations were so inspiring and so supportive. Not to imply that Netflix wasn’t, but it was just a different level of conversation. And Jennifer Salke, the head of Prime Video, is just a phenomenal individual, as is her team. We are the first show of this kind that the team has done. So, the support that we’ve received while working out the conceptual aspect and then while taping, the support we received was just unbelievable.
You and Heidi seem to have the best time when together. What has it been like to work with her for all these years?
What’s so interesting is, we do have a great time together, but on Runway, we barely interacted. She had her role; I had mine. The only time we would really interact was during the last six seasons when I was presenting the models to the judges. The top three and bottom three.
In Making the Cut, we are joined at the hip the whole time. It’s fantastic. We have a blast. In each episode, there’s a vignette that doesn’t enhance the plot, but it shows Heidi and me in a light that people really haven’t seen us in. We’re making croissants in Paris; I arranged for Heidi to dance with the Moulin Rouge; we have a blast. Because those vignettes are rather long, I haven’t seen the final cut of the show, I think they’re moving the vignettes onto a Making the Cut YouTube channel, so you can watch them in their entirety.
Related article: One Woman Weighs in on Plus Size Fashion Subscription Boxes
I saw that Making the Cut will also feature models of all sizes. As we know, this has been a problematic issue for years. Do you think the fashion industry is getting better with this?
Well, generally speaking, yes, but it needs to get even better. The wonderful thing about working with Amazon is that their customer is a real person. Their customer is not one of those rare, couture purchasers.
So, even the sizing aspect, working with Amazon has been phenomenally gratifying and rewarding because these winning looks will be shoppable in 200 countries and territories, and Amazon knows all the metrics of sizing in various regions, and the sophistication is mind blowing. With models of all sizes on Making the Cut, we don’t even talk about it. It’s just very matter-of-fact. They’re here.
Why do you think it took ‘til Season 16 for Project Runway to finally get plus-size models?
It was a battle with the network. That constant, constant battle, and finally the network cried uncle, and we were allowed to do it. Our ratings went up almost 20 percent, and that was because of the models!
That is mind-blowing. You would think the network would have done that much sooner.
Absolutely. I was on a failed, ABC daytime show called The Revolution back in, I don’t remember when it was, seems like forever ago, but also seems like yesterday. I was desperate to do a plus-size fashion show, and no one would support it.
I said, who do you think is sitting at home watching the show at 1:00 in the afternoon? They said, absolutely not because we don’t want people to feel bad. I said, the whole point of this is, it’ll feel fantastic! They’ll feel inspired; we’ll see how great they can look. That’s the point!
How do you feel about Christian Siriano taking over for you as the contestants’ mentor on Project Runway?
I’m happy for him, and I hope he’s happy. I’ll be honest with you; I maintained that I will always be an honest person. I haven’t seen the show since I left, so I can honestly say I have no idea what it’s like. I’m happy for all of them, and I wish them success.
What do you think your life would be like if you never got involved with the fashion industry?
A blessing [laughs]. I mean, I have to say, I have the greatest respect and regard for the industry. Do you know how I got involved?
Not your entire backstory. My apologies.
No, that’s okay! A lot of people don’t know. People ask, when did I become interested in fashion, when did I decide this is what I wanted to do? I never did. Fashion came after me. I was a teacher and administrator at Parsons, and my roles of administrator was basically, I was a Mr. Fix It. I called myself a pooper scooper. I descended into academic departments where there were problems, and I was there to diagnose and prescribe.
There was a crisis of leadership in the fashion program, arguably the most famous program at Parsons, and I was sent in for a semester to work with the department and update the curriculum. Denny, I was shocked by how backward and mismanaged the entire place was. I said to the dean, ‘This place is hemorrhaging. This is not a one-semester diagnosis and prescription. The curriculum has remained unchanged for 50 years.’
It was the year 2000 when I was sent in, but I said, it’s a matter of pedagogy. The way in which the curriculum is delivered to the students. This place is absolutely pin-drop silent because no one is allowed to speak except for the faculty. There’s no participation; there’s no such thing as a group critique where people talk about each other’s work. In some ways, fixing it was the easiest thing in the world. These students didn’t have a history of the discipline that they’re practicing. Can you imagine? I mean, super irresponsible.
So, I needed to learn about this industry, and it was like going back to graduate school. What really gulled me was the perception of the heads of other academic departments at Parsons. The perception being, ‘Ugh, fashion, who cares? It’s so inconsequential; it’s so ephemeral; it lacks a soul; it’s not serious.’ I thought, ‘I’m disgusted, and I’m going to get behind American fashion in particular and wave the flag and talk about why this is so important and why it is so serious.’
I had gone to a conference of fashion educators that was held in Europe after I’ve been in the department for about six months. I think it’s important to meet these other people and find out what they’re doing. I was the only person from an American school, and I was reviled. It was for a very specific reason because we look at fashion through the lens of commerce. I said proudly that we look at it through a lens of commerce. Otherwise, who cares? So, yes, I’m proud of the fact that we look at it through the lens of commerce. That’s certainly what we’re doing with Making the Cut.
So, fashion just fell into your lap and lead you to where we are today.
Yes. I mean, who knew? The producers of Project Runway were looking for a consultant. I was never intended to be on the show, and I didn’t even want to meet with them when they called me. I said, fashion reality, the industry has enough trouble without that. However, I met with them, and I was impressed with their seriousness, and it became this serendipitous path. I talk about it all the time; you never know where it’s going to take you.
Exactly. Do you have a clothing item or accessory that you never leave home without?
Well, underwear [laughs].
Besides the essentials.
Um, well, no. The things that I always have with me are the essentials. Underwear, belt, wallet. Otherwise, I change things up.
Can we expect a Season Two of Making the Cut?
We are hoping so, but this pandemic is throwing us some serious curve balls. Heidi and I made a call out weeks ago before this happened. We made a call out for auditions, but people can’t travel. I mean, we can do a lot virtually, but you want to meet these people. So, things are on hold, but we are crossing our fingers that it will happen.
What trends should we be on the lookout for this spring and summer?
Oh, God, Denny, I’m the anti-trend guy. I always said to people, if there’s a trend out there that pulls at your heartstrings, go ahead. Otherwise, just ignore it. I’m an advocate for finding items, silhouettes, proportions, colors that work for you and just keep wearing them. One of the nice things about fashion today today is that there really is something for everyone.
What’s next for you? Any other upcoming projects we should be on the lookout for?
I don’t have my radar up for anything at the moment. I’m ecstatic to sit back and enjoy the unfolding of this first season of Making the Cut, but we’ll see. Like I said earlier, life’s path can be very serendipitous. You never know what’s coming up, but I will also say I’m so lucky. I’ve had so many incredible opportunities I never dreamed would have happened, and the whole TV phenomenon happened after I turned 50.
I mean, when do you have a second life like that? But, because I have been so lucky and had so many wonderful opportunities, whenever I’m asked, ‘What would you want to do that you haven’t done,’ I feel it would be like throwing hubris in the face of an angry god. Don’t go there; I’ll be struck by lightning. I’m just very, very lucky and grateful.
And we are very happy for you! We look forward to watching Making the Cut on Amazon. Now, before we leave, can you please say your signature line?
Make it work, Denny!
[Laughs] Thank you so much for your time, Tim. It’s been a pleasure.
No, thank you. It was a lot of fun talking to you. Stay well!
Photos by Scott McDonald
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